His House (2020)

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign. Hello, everyone. Welcome back to the final girl on 6th Avenue podcast. My name is Carolyn Smith Hillmer and I am 6th Avenue's very own Final Girl. And today I'm really excited because we are going to be talking about yet another marvelous Sundance film. This actually was a 2020 Sundance Film Festival film and that's where it premiered anyhow. But it was released by Netflix and is still on Netflix to this day. We're going to be talking about the 2020 film His House. His House. Looking at IMDb is about a refugee couple making a harrowing escape from a war torn South Sudan. But then they struggle to adjust to their new life in an English town that has an evil lurking beneath the surface. This episode is going to be maybe a little bit different than my normal episodes because I have come to realize that there is a lot of history surrounding this film that maybe on a first time watch, if you're not familiar, particularly if you grew up in America or went through like the American education system at any point in time, there's really very, very little about African history that we actually learn about. And so there's more context that can be provided to aid in your viewing of this film. And most importantly, this is, you know, these are real people that exist in the real world and we would not be empathetic in any capacity if we did not take the time to understand and, or learn about them. And that's my opinion. But if you don't like it, you can turn this shit off. Okay, so I'm hoping to provide you some color here after we discuss the film. And maybe I will be able to provide some tidbits throughout the episode to kind of aid in your understanding of what makes these things so scary or what makes these things so tragic, in a sense. And I also want to just say very clearly at the beginning of this that this will not be a political episode. We are talking in this film about refugees. I will not be providing any political commentary throughout this episode about, you know, how I feel though, and I'm going to try my best to do that. I really am. I think the one thing I can say is that I empathize very, very, very much so with those who are in desperate situations and are attempting to, you know, live better lives, live safer lives, provide better for their children, provide better for their family, or even just provide better for themselves. So my what I hope you'll gain from this episode is perhaps a. A different perspective. Right. And also that maybe you will be able to empathize with the characters in this film and that maybe that will shape your perspective on the world. So I'm going to leave it at that. So let's start to talking about the fantastic film His House, written and directed by Remy Weeks. And, yeah, I hope you enjoy this episode. Our film opens with a dream sequence, actually. There is the couple that, you know, we'll be discussing. Their names are Ball and Riel. Ball and Rial are currently being held in a. Essentially like a detention center. It's like a probational center for which the government is holding them in order to provide them with housing. They're granted asylum in Britain. And so, like, they're staying in this. This place until they get assigned housing. But anyway, Bald is sleeping and he has this dream that he's dreaming of essentially their journey from South Sudan. They are, you know, rounded up in groups and they are all the people of South Sudan or being essentially rounded up into, you know, planes, trains and automobiles, essentially to get them out of where they are. But they take a truck and then they eventually end up in a boat and they have their daughter with them. And along the journey when they are traversing the English Channel to, you know, seek this asylum, they. They lose their daughter. It's common for people to. To drown in these types of excursions, you could say. And so this is another instance just showing how dangerous this journey truly is for these people to be leaving. And they. They do lose their daughter and a few others from their boat to drowning. Ball wakes up to Riel and he is approached in their room by an immigration officer. And they are essentially going to be granting them their probational asylum status and assigning them a living space. They're also given certain conditions by which they have to abide by. And if they break any of these conditions, then they are on their way back to the detention center and potentially on their way back to South Sudan. And obviously we know what's waiting for them in South Sudan. So that would be, you know, worst case scenario. They are to be given 74 pounds weekly. They are not to work or supplement their earnings in any other capacity. They are to report to the immigration per personnel weekly, and they can't miss any reporting. And the final condition is that they are to live in the home that they are assigned to live in and not anywhere else. So, like, they can't move anywhere else. They have to live in this exact house that they're being assigned to live in. And Ball tries to, you know, make it a point to say, like, we're good people. And the immigration you know, personnel is basically like, you don't have to prove to me whether you're good people or not. He's kind of just like, look like, I get where you're coming from, and I appreciate the sentiment, but I'm just here to tell you the rules that you have to live by if you're gonna live here. So they're not citizens, but they're able to stay. Now, the. The home that they arrive at I can only describe as derelict. And that would be putting it nicely. It's. They are grateful that they have a roof, but it. The. The house is. Is filthy and the walls are peeling. They have holes in them. They walk in and there's like a pizza box in there with half eaten pizza from whoever was there before, and it's covered in cockroaches. The electricity doesn't work. When the government official that's, you know, bringing them to the home opens the front door with the key, the door actually just kind of breaks off the hinges, and again, no electricity. The gas, like, barely works on the stove. But they're just relieved to have a roof, right? That roof, that's theirs. And the government official that, you know, shows them the place, brings them a box of essentials, you know, some cleaning products, some bread, some food items, just to kind of get them through their initial arrival and whatnot. And he makes it a point to tell them that, you know, normally the house that our living space that we would assign to you would be, you know, smaller than this, but with more people. But you guys get this pretty large, you know, living area, and it's just for the two of you. So Ball asks him why they are so special to receive this home, and the guy is just like, I don't know, you must have just won the jackpot, I guess. So he signed some paperwork with the official, and the official is like, wow, you have a pretty confident and good signature. And Ball says, I used to work in a bank. So that's what he used to do before now. And yeah, I mean, they're. I wouldn't say that they're like, thrilled with the condition of the home, but, like, they're gonna try their damnedest to make the best out of it and to not, you know, be an issue for they're gonna follow, like, all the conditions that they were provided, and they're not gonna break any rules of the housing and they're going to, you know, meet the neighbors and whatnot. During their first night in the home, Ball and Riel talk about, you know, how this is a new beginning for them and that this is more than what they could ask for, right? And so. But the first night in the house is just something that is, again, it's touchy, right, because they're happy to be there, but there's just some things that are just not quite right about this house. And they're coming to find out pretty damn early what's not right about it, right? So they are. We see Ball, right, And he's downstairs, and he's hearing laughing and shouting outside of the windows. And you know that they enter on the ground floor, right? So they're on street level. If they're in the living room and he's hearing, like, these people outside, and then someone throws something at the window in the living room, which scares him and gives him, like, a PTSD type of response. And so in his head, he can just hear screaming and crying and shouting. And he kind of lives with that for a second, but then, you know, quickly tries to divert his attention or just snap himself out of that. That type of memory recall. And once he does, he hears some type of rustling and, like, maybe a banging sound inside the wall. And so this wall in particular has a large piece of the wall missing near the floor. And so he goes and gets down on the floor and reaches his arm inside of this opening in the wall to try to see what's in there. And he can't find anything. He can't find anything at all. And so then maybe one of the most terrifying shots in film history, he's laying on his side and he lifts up his head off the floor during this investigation into the wall. And when he does that, there is someone on the floor laying down behind him who gasps loudly and scares the shit out of him and of me, by the way. And then a bird, floor flies out of the opening in the wall. There was a bird in there. That's what the noise was. But fuck, man, if this is your first time, you know, in a house in a new country that you've never been to, I would be scared out of my fucking mind. That's first and foremost. The next morning, Riel wakes up. She wakes up alone to some commotion downstairs. And it is Ball who has apparently not slept the entire night, which I can't say that I blame him at all for that after his experience. And he is fixing the front door. He is trying his best to, you know, get this place to be livable and as tidy as possible. And so one thing to do immediately, right, is to fix the door so he's doing that and he puts on nice outfit and he takes the trash out and he looks out from his, you know, front porch or front yard, and there's a woman sitting in a window, one of the neighbors, and she's just sitting there petting her cat. And he smiles and waves to say hello, and she just stares at him. So he's a little bit offended by that interaction, as most of us would be. And it's very impolite for a fucking country who shits on everyone else every second of their lives for not having manners. But I digress. So he leaves and he goes and gets a haircut. And he is asking the barber, where are we? And the barber's like, well, we're on this street and that street is in London. And it's almost like, I mean, he really, Ball really did not know, like, where they actually were located. So this is the first time he's finding out that this is London. And so he's walking back and he is walking by a church. And this church shouts out. This man from outside the church shouts out to Ball and says, hey, are you a refugee? If you do, if you are like, we have something for you. And so he goes inside the church and he leaves and with this giant box of just like essentials, toothbrush, toothpaste, some snacks, some cookies, like just a bunch of supplies, really. I think all churches should take note of this, by the way out there. I think you might all know if you've been listening to the show for some time, how I feel about churches and about many organized religions. But yeah, I don't think anywhere in the Bible since I have read it, does God say that we turn our back on others. So just, if you're a church going citizen, you may want to just keep that in your, your noggin for a little while. So then he is kind of like, okay, I need to, you know, we need to find ways to prove that we're like assimilating because our caseworker and, you know, immigration officials were really like harping on us for these things. And so he's really wanting to like, prove that like, he can do this. So he goes out of his way to stop by a pub before going home with, you know, his stuff that he's just received from the church. And he. They're watching football, soccer, as most people know that have been to the uk this is an incredibly common occurrence and oftentimes pretty fun. So they're singing a song, right? They all have like football songs that they sing. And so he participates in one of these songs that he presumably knows, and he kind of gains the approval from the other men that are in the bar with him. So that's like a pretty good feeling for him. Then he goes home and he tells Rial about his day. And she's kind of like, well, why were you singing a song? Why are grown men singing songs about football? This is kind of like the dumbest thing I've maybe ever heard of. But he's like, it's just fun, you know, just chill. And so she's like, you know what? Maybe I'll go out tomorrow. Maybe she's kind of thinking now, like, okay, maybe I need to get out there and see what's going on out there. So night two in this house looks a little different than night one, but still, you know, still some shit going on, right? So Ball is awake again. In this neighborhood, there's just like. Seems to be people outside a lot and people outside at night. And I just want to say this, and I really, like, I just want to get this out off my chest and, like, out of the way. People are always shitting on Americans for being loud. That is not true. We may be loud, but if you think we're loud, you should go to the uk. Okay? Shit is loud. People are loud. People are drunk and they're outside. And why are people outside when they're drunk at night? I will tell you this because I have come to understand this, that all of the fucking bars and stuff close at, like, they close early. They close at 11. Coincidentally, there's nowhere to really go because you can't go to another bar because the bars are closed. So, like, you just kind of are outside. And also, drunk driving is incredibly common in the UK and Ireland. I'm just gonna throw that out there as well. So if you are driving there and you're going to drive anytime after, I don't know, let's call it 8pm Be careful, please. It's dangerous. Those roads there are very dangerous. Okay, so just want to get that out of the way. So anyway, there's people being loud outside, right? And so he's awake, and then he hears what sounds like footsteps coming up the stairs to the bedroom. So he gets up and he kind of like goes downstairs. There's nothing to be seen except when he goes into the living room, he looks at the wall and a giant piece of the wall just peels right off. And he's like, okay, you know, what the fuck is this? And there's a Giant hole in the center of this, like, missing piece of wall. And there's, like, a something hanging that he can see. So he starts to pull on it to see what it is. And as soon as he does that, then the lights go out and the power goes out. But he's pretty committed to pulling on whatever this is. So he pulls and pulls and pulls. And what he finds is that there is a rope, and it's covered in, like, dead seaweed. And he's pulling this out of the wall. And as he's pulling, right, the front door behind him, like, starts to open slowly. And then someone approaches and stands behind him. When he finally gets to the end of this rope, he sees their daughters, right? Their daughter that drowned. She had a doll. And they've kept the doll this whole time. The doll is attached to this rope that he just pulled out of the wall, covered in seaweed. And as soon as he sees it, two hands reach from inside the wall, grab the doll and pull it back. He turns around, there's no one there. He's freaked out. The next morning, he comes downstairs, and that piece of wall that had previously peeled off is no longer peeled off. And the wall is in the exact condition it was before this happened. Once Riel wakes up the next morning, ball is nowhere to be found. And he had spent the entire night peeling the paint off of the wall in the living room that he just experienced this supernatural event. Now, they weren't allowed to damage the house, right? So Rial is kind of a little nervous, but he's peeled all the paint off. So in an attempt to, like, start to clean up this message, she starts to sweep up all the pieces of the wall and the wood and the paint and kind of compile it together and try to clean up. And so she goes and opens one of the closets in the downstairs area, where presumably they're keeping, like, cleaning supplies and maybe something else. And when she opens the door, she sees a truck of children, like, from South Sudan. And she's not frightened by it, she's just sad. So she closes the door back. So BAAL goes to the store, and he's picking up some tools. He's, like, really admiring this hammer that he's finding. And meanwhile, poor Riel. I, like, this is so sad, but she's. So. She's as someone, myself, right, who has been in a foreign country and been fucking lost out of my mind. Like, I empathize with this sequence so, so much. So she's walking and essentially she's trying to go to the clinic. Their caseworker told them there was a clinic nearby a short walk away and draws them a map on how to get there. Doesn't give them a physical map, but draws them a map. So she leaves the house and she takes this map. Well, she keeps like running into issues because this map is. It's hand drawn and it's the shittiest, most non descriptive map in the whole entire world. And so she keeps like finding herself, like in circles, like just not able to get where she needs to go. And it's like a maze. So she eventually finds this group of like, I would say like 15, 14 or 15 year old boys. And they're black boys. So she approaches because presumably like the way that they looked made her feel comfortable enough to do so. And so she approaches them to ask for directions. They're trying to, like, they're arguing with each other about like, how to get to this specific street. And she's very confused. She does speak English, but like, it's not her primary language, right? Like, she still speaks in her native language and so she does understand, but it's, you know, it's kind of like anytime you speak anything as a secondary language, there's definitely a little bit of processing time that you need to kind of like get your wits about you. And so they're making fun of the way that she pronounces the name of the street. They finally give her some directions and then as she's walking away, they tell her to go back to Africa. She finally does make it to the clinic and she has a very friendly, like, you know, nurse figure who's like taking care of her and helping and, you know, just getting her vitals, doing some blood work, checking her blood pressure, blah, blah, blah. Then like, you're trying to make small talk, right? Because you're like in a room together and you're just alone. So this clinic worker is talking to real and is basically like, oh, I like your necklace. And she says, oh, well, thank you, like, it was my daughter's. And the worker is like, well, have you registered her yet? Like, you should probably do that. Riel doesn't say anything. And then the clinic worker is then like, oh, those are very pretty. And she's talking about these marks that Riel has, and she has markings on her face, on the side of her face, and also on her arm. And she explains to this woman that where she's from, there are two tribes, and depending on which one you belong to, you mark yourself with the symbol of that tribe. So she was originally given one marking when she was a little girl. And after she found her entire family butchered in their house, she marked herself with the markings of the other tribe with a knife, right? Like, these are, like things that you carve into your skin. And so she did this so that she had the markings of both tribes so that she could then belong simultaneously to both of them and to neither of them so that she could survive and then lets it, you know, lets it be known to this worker that they lost their daughter while they were crossing the. The sea. So Riel comes back home. She stops at the grocery store on the way, and she picks up, you know, just some food items as you do, and she goes and she's sitting in the living room and she hears a commotion behind her. And when she turns around, the entire bag of fruit produce that she had just purchased from the grocery store is somehow fallen off of the counter and is all over the floor. And so there's one piece of fruit that rolls directly to her all the way from the kitchen. And once she sees it, she looks at it and she hears someone from inside of the wall say, come, come. And the, you know, it looks like a nectarine. Honestly, it rolls under then the wall, and she's just kind of like, okay, that was weird. But she's not really letting it, like, bother her too bad. So she makes dinner, and Ball comes home and he's like, oh, you went outside today. Like, that's great. He sits down. Well, actually, no, before he sits down to eat dinner with her, he notices that they're sitting on the floor. Right. Very common in other places around the world to sit on the floor to eat meals. This is nothing new. I think we all know this. What you may not know is that in some. I can't speak for all African countries, but in some it is, you know, common to eat with no utensils and to simply use, like, bread as your. As a way to, like, scoop food or like a way to soak up food so that you can eat it. Very common in Ethiopian food. And from what it appears to be in this film, apparently this happens also in Sudanese food. So he says, maybe we use the table next time we want to eat. And then before he sits down, he says, oh, wait, and he goes to the kitchen and he gets silverware. Now, what you may also not know is that the UK has a national dish, and the national dish of. Well, actually, sorry, I should be specific. The national dish of Britain is chicken tikka masala. Chicken tikka Masala is not a British dish. It is an Indian dish. And do you know how you eat that dish? Traditionally? You eat it with your fucking hands. So I found this whole sequence to be a little interesting because, like, you're supposed to eat their national dish with your hands, and yet he wants to use the silverware. But I digress. He's clearly trying to make a more, you know, like, targeted effort for assimilation. And she's kind of maybe not even thinking about it because this is just how life has always been. They've always eaten on the floor and they've always eaten with their hands. So he gives her a fork and she uses it, but she's like, I don't know. All I can taste is the metal. And Ball is like, well, you kind of get used to it. And, you know, there's lots of jobs here. I was walking around today and they. You know, it seems like they actually give people a chance here. So he's very optimistic. Rial decides that this is a great. [00:30:45] Speaker B: Opportunity to talk to Ball about her experience that day. And she starts this by telling him that her mother used to tell her a story. In this story, there was a man who wanted a house, a place of his own, so badly that he would do anything to get it. And so, in order to achieve his dream of having this place of his own, he stole from an elderly man by a river. And when this happened, he didn't know it yet. [00:31:31] Speaker A: But he stole from what. [00:31:33] Speaker B: She refers to as an apeth, which is a night witch, essentially, like a dark witch. [00:31:42] Speaker A: And so then, when the man finally got his place of solitude, the apeth. [00:31:49] Speaker B: Followed him and lived in the walls of this house as well. And the only way that she knows about, you know, this story is because it's told as a cautionary tale. And that this story is relevant today because there is an apeth that followed them from the sea and is living with them in their home in the walls. And that she happened to speak to this apeth today. And BAAL is like, yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever. But, like, what did they say? [00:32:32] Speaker A: And. [00:32:33] Speaker B: And Riel says that they said that if they leave this house and go back to a country where they're going. [00:32:44] Speaker A: To die, that if they do that. [00:32:49] Speaker B: And repay their debt, whatever this debt is, then this whole thing can essentially be over. And, you know, she also brings up a point that she really wanted to make, which is that she feels that their daughter is still alive. Now, this makes Ball really fucking mad because they lost their daughter on their journey across the English Channel. And he knows this. So for her to say this and essentially sort of be in this sort of denial about her, about her life or her death really pisses him off. And he's like, we've grieved enough over this. Like, I. I don't want to talk about this anymore. She's gone. We lost her. That's just what happened. So later that night, Ball gets the opportunity to see their dead daughter. Her name is Nyagak, and she is presenting herself in the ways that the other figures are presenting themselves. Number one, terrifying. Number two, terrifying. Number three, not of this world, necessarily. And so he has this experience where he sees Nyagak, and she is calling out for her mom, and she's also taking what it looks like a knife, but it's like, a sharp object. It may be a knife. I really can't tell. And she's stabbing the wood in the floor with it. And then she turns and tries to attack Bull as well. He goes, like, outside. He runs outside. He's like, well, whatever's going on in that house, not for me, so no, thank you. And he runs outside. And the fucking neighbor who was out there the first time that he went outside and he waved up at. And she didn't wave back. Yeah, it's her. She's constantly smoking cigarettes outside. [00:35:12] Speaker A: Or. [00:35:12] Speaker B: Well, not outside. She's smoking him inside with the window open. So she's like quasi outside. So he tries to play it cool. He waves, he smiles. [00:35:21] Speaker A: Okay. [00:35:23] Speaker B: He goes back inside the house, and he's like, you know what? Everything that we brought with us from Sudan is cursed. So all of it, we have to get rid of all of it. Everything that we brought with us has to go. And against, you know, all of the wishes of Riel, he takes all their stuff that they brought with them and burns it outside, including the doll that they had from their dead daughter. And also he essentially forces Riel to remove the necklace that she was wearing from their daughter. Ball the next day, decides he's gonna go to a department store, and he, you know, again, is really on this mission to assimilate. And so part of that is looking the part, right? And so he goes to a department store, and he finds, like, a discount department store, and he finds some clothing. He basically looks at an advertisement of a man in the store and buys exactly that outfit. And I would be inclined to also shop at wherever this is because he bought a polo for £7 and chinos for, like, £16. And I don't know about you, but that's a screaming good deal if you ask me, especially in pounds. Okay, that's really good. So he puts on this new outfit. He comes home and he's like, I'll be damned if I'm not fixing the electricity, right? So he is up in the wall, he's rolling around on the floor. He slices his hand clean open, and he's like, I am going to get the power back on in this house if my life depends on it. And he does. He actually does. I. I am not surprised by how handy he is, but also slightly surprised, especially, like, different country, different layouts of, like, you know, how things are built and whatnot. And we don't know exactly if he had electricity in his home that was wired like this, right. In their home country or their native country. And so, like, anyway, the man is incredibly handy, and I have to give it up for him, really. He all of my applause. So then that night, they sit down to have dinner. Meal times are evidently a rather contentious time for the couple, and you can tell that their relationship is slowly starting to fall apart. Essentially, when Ball walks into the dining room to eat, he finds Riel speaking to an empty chair. But we can read between the lines and understand that perhaps she's speaking to their daughter. And she's kind of saying things like, well, have you tried to talk to him? Like, he doesn't not want you around, things like that. So he's kind of pissed. So he sits down and they are eating at the actual table this time, which you can tell that for real, is not obviously very comfortable for her. And there's silverware on the table. And when you look at them both, she's using her hands to eat, like, with bread, like we previously discussed. And he is using the silverware. He's also wearing this, you know, outfit that he bought at the department store earlier that day. And she's still wearing, you know, some more of, like, the clothes that they would wear in their native country versus wearing, you know, the clothes or the types of clothes that would be worn in Britain. And so she's like, I feel like you think that I'm crazy. And he's like, I mean, honestly, I just think it's not good for you to be alone all the time. Like, we need to find tomorrow something that you can do and maybe in the community, right? Like, get you out, do something that's, like, morally good and you can be involved. And then this way you won't be sitting and just dwelling with your thoughts all the time, right? And she makes it A point to say that we are not like them. And he says, but we can be. So really the. A lot of the contention between the two of them comes about because they're, you know, he's trying his best to. I don't want to use the word assimilate because these are very, like, minute things, right? Like, and even. I don't really want to use the term assimilate, but I don't really know a better word to describe it. But essentially, like, who the fuck cares if you want to eat on the floor? I don't care. Other countries do it all the time. Who the fuck cares if you want to use the silverware or not? I don't give a fuck if you want to use silverware. I don't care what you wear. Like, none of this stuff really matters, right? [00:40:37] Speaker A: But he. [00:40:40] Speaker B: Really feels like, you know, to prove to this government that he is wanting to stay or like, going to stay, that he needs to become like the people in Britain. And real is just kind of not really buying into this whole thing because it's not her. And it obviously feels very unnatural. And so this is a point in the film in which you really feel like the tension between the two of them. And then she kind of just is like, you know what? You know what? Don't you ever wonder what me and this apeth are talking about? And BAAL is like, okay, you know what? Fuck it. I. No, I don't. I actually don't. I think you're crazy and you are entertaining yourself with these imaginary things in the dark. Like, this is just ridiculous to him. And she's like, I really. I'm not frightening myself after I have seen the evils that man can do, right? War, war, murder. Her family being massacred. Like, do you really think that I will be afraid of a bump in the night? Do you actually think that this is something that would frighten me? He kind of holds her hand, but she pulls away. And she's just. She's just fed up with this. She makes it a point to say that the apethe says that we can get our daughter back. She leaves the table. And then we get this incredible scene where it is simply a cutout of the wall and the floor with Ball sitting at the kitchen table, continuing to eat his meal. But as we zoom out, behind him is the sea, you know, that they traverse to get to their safety in Britain. And he looks out amongst the sea in the water and sees just piles of dead bodies, things, you know, people coming out of the water and Walking toward him. And it's a very frightening image, right? And they're coming out of everywhere. So he falls back off of his chair into the water. And, I mean, I'm telling you, these things are coming out of the woodwork. He wakes up in the living room with his back against the wall. He had been. He's sitting up. Like he's just sleeping, sitting up, and he's frightened. And then he starts to hear the. This creaking and this growling noise. And all of the, you know, people or things that were coming out of the water in his dream are emerging in the living room of his own house. He can see them in the dark, but he can't see them when he turns the lights on. So he wants to keep the light on in terms of feeling safe, right? Their daughter is there. She's saying she's cold, she can't swim, she needs help. And, I mean, he's just mortified as all of these. Every time he turns the lights back off, like, there's more fucking people or more of these fucking things that are coming out, and they want to kill him. They are essentially so many of them that they are holding him and to where he can't move. And then his daughter, it comes on top of his, you know, shoulders and puts a knife to his throat. And he struggles for a bit, but he finally makes it to, you know, the light switch to turn on the lights so that this whole thing can end. So now he's fucking pissed, right? He's like, this is my house. I don't understand. [00:44:54] Speaker A: You have to leave. [00:44:56] Speaker B: I live here. This is my house. And he takes his hammer and starts to bash holes into the walls in some sort of effort to like, make it to where, like, these. These things have nowhere to hide or nowhere to retreat to and just destroys this living room. So the next day, he goes down and he meets his caseworker, and he's like, hey, I actually want to talk to you about our house. And the caseworker is like, you want to live somewhere else, I'm assuming? And he's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, that would be great. You know, and the caseworker is like, okay. I mean, you live in a house that's bigger than mine and all of the people who work in this office, but you want to move. And ball is like, dude, yeah, there's. You know what? It turns out that there's rats. There's rats in the house. There's vermin and bugs. And my. My wife, she's really, really sick because of it. And, you know, she went to the doctor, and the doctor said, we need to move out immediately. And so the caseworker is like, okay, you know, this is gonna have to be inspected, obviously, because, like, you're essentially saying that this place is, like, uninhabitable. So, like, we need to. There's. There's gonna be a lot of questions. There's gonna be a lot of paperwork. There's gonna be a lot of inspecting. Eventually, he's just like, okay, look, there's just something wrong with this house. There's just something wrong. Like, he doesn't want anybody to come in and, like, see it, and he just wants it to be over. And I guess he just thought that this is something that was going to be an easy thing to take care of. But obviously, when you're dealing with the government, nothing's easy. And so the caseworker's like, look, I know you used to work in a bank, and so did I. And my job got taken away when all the banking jobs moved overseas, so I don't get to work in a bank either. And the point is now, right, that we all end up in places that we never thought we'd end up in. And this is just life trying to show you and allow you the opportunity to demonstrate what kind of man you actually are. So bull is. You know, he's just like, okay, I'm done. He leaves and he goes home. [00:47:34] Speaker A: Well. [00:47:37] Speaker B: Riel is at home, and she's sitting on the couch that they have in their living room, and she hears her daughter calling for her. And so she looks towards the wall, and from a hole in the wall, a hand emerges and drops the necklace. The necklace that she was under the impression was burned. And she turns to look around the room to the other wall, and she sees the faces of all of these. These people, right. Right before Ball opens the front door to his house. Okay, the fucking neighbor who's always smoking the cigarettes, of course, is outside, and she's like, why don't you just leave? And he's like, I'm not leaving because. [00:48:26] Speaker A: This is my house. [00:48:28] Speaker B: Not to mention the government told me that I'm literally not allowed to leave this house, and I'm not allowed to live anywhere other than this house right fucking here. So this is where I'm gonna live. And she's like, I don't know, man. I give it, like, one more week. Honestly, like, I'm trying to help you. Really, you should just go now. He's like, whatever, again, fucking done with you. Thank you so much for your input. And he goes inside the house. And shortly thereafter, the caseworker shows up and is like, okay, let me see what's going on inside the house. Since you. You know, you want to move, and you say that it's infested with rats. Meanwhile, everything in London, in. Around London is infested with rats. But that's neither here nor there. Everything's just old. New York has a similar issue. And so they. You know, he comes inside, and the house is just. Obviously, we've seen the destruction that Ball has inflicted onto the living room walls. And this is the first time that the caseworker is seeing it. And he's like, yo, these. These holes in this wall are so big. There's. These must be the most enormous rats ever to live. So do you want to just tell me, like, what's really going on? So the caseworker is like. [00:49:51] Speaker A: This. [00:49:51] Speaker B: This is crazy. Like, I have to take pictures of this. Like, I'm gonna have to report it. Like, there's gonna be an inquiry. This is. This. This is a lot. And Ball is like, okay, look, let me fix it. Give me the opportunity. Clearly, he's handy because he's fixed everything else. So I have no qualms about the man fixing the wall. I mean, I'm sure he could build a whole house with his two bare hands at this point. So he's like, please, like, we're. We're the good ones. [00:50:21] Speaker A: We. [00:50:21] Speaker B: We really. We really don't want to go back. I will fix it. So then the caseworker is like, okay, you know what? For this time, we'll let you off with a warning. Very generous of him to do this. Rial comes out, and she's like, oh, by the way, have you told them about the witch yet? So she's like, y', all, here's the deal. There's a great beast in this house, and it knows great magic, and it followed us here, and my husband's been chasing it in the walls all night with a hammer because he's very stubborn. And they are basically, you know, ghosts. And they are trying to bait my husband into accepting this spirit of our dead daughter. And he's so stubborn. He just won't accept it. And, like, you know, whatever. So the caseworker leaves, and he had brought, like, another caseworker on, you know, just. I guess they needed a second person. And as they walk back to the car, they say, wow. Well, they can kiss England goodbye. And, you know, she's wearing. Riyal is wearing something that she would have worn traditionally right in. In her country. And. But the other guy makes a comment and says, like, did you see what she was wearing? She had on her fucking bed sheets. That's rude. Okay, that's. Both of those comments are very fucking rude. Like, that's just not cool. But anyways, Riel and Ball watch from the window as, you know, they. They leave the caseworkers, and she's like, you know what? This is what they want. They want to see us get crazy or look crazy because it makes them feel better than they are. But really what they are is weak and bored and lazy, and I feel bad for them because they have nothing better to do than essentially harass our home. And, you know, Ball is like, I just. I just want you to stop. Like, we have escaped from great tragedy and we should be grateful for being here. And she's like, you know what? No. Because even after all this, you idolize these people and you beg them to accept you. And, you know, you thank them for the shitty, unseasoned scraps of food and whatever else that they give to us. And, you know, you. [00:53:09] Speaker A: You want to be them. [00:53:10] Speaker B: Essentially, she eventually just says, like, you know what? Honestly, let's just let him send us back. And Ball is like, no, because this is our home. Like, we live here. And she says, you know what? Well, I'm leaving anyway, with or without you. And Ball is just like, I just want to remind you super quickly of know what we went through to get here. [00:53:39] Speaker A: Just. [00:53:39] Speaker B: Just a quick reminder. So Riel brings up their, you know, unfortunately, their deceased daughter. And this is where Ball starts to fucking lose his mind, okay? He puts his hand over her mouth, and he's like, I'm done listening to you talk about this. We're not going to get her back, okay? Doesn't matter what we do. You're sick. You're crazy. So he takes his magic hammer that he uses to do everything else in the house, and he starts breaking off all of the interior doorknobs and window latches so that way Riel can't get out. So this time, Ball is like, you know what? This thing, whatever. This witch, a peth. Whatever, this time it's gonna talk to me. So he lights a candle in the center of the living room, and he waits. Eventually, this apethe comes to him and calls him a thief. And he reminds BAAL that, you know, this life is not yours because you stole it. And in order to repay your debt, you, this beast of the world, are going to listen to Me as the butcher, and just know that it doesn't matter where you go in this world. I will be following you every step of the way, because now you are mine. Ball is like, okay, so what do you want? And the apeth is like, okay, well, here's the deal. Here's a knife. You give your life to repay the debt of your daughter's death. The apeth then forces BAAL to, you know, see essentially, like, through a vision, his dead daughter in the sea. And as she stands and stares at Ball, she opens her mouth and an octopus crawls out. And then we see Riel, and she is looking at Ball very closely because he is completely 100% catatonic. So she finds the, you know, the interior doorknob that Ball had removed, and she's putting it back on. And as you know, she's doing it. He wakes up from his catatonic state and comes and tries to pull her away from the doorknob to fight her on this. She stabs him in the leg with the screwdriver that she was using and locks him into another room in the house. And she escapes through opening one of the windows. And as she runs out the window, she's inexplicably back in Sudan. [00:56:49] Speaker A: On, you. [00:56:50] Speaker B: Know, a familiar place. It's basically like a school ground, I think it is. And, like, she knows where she is. And as she is a little confused why she's there or how she's there, there are familiar faces all around, and so she feels comfortable. Almost immediately, she enters, you know, the classroom and sits, and the whole room is full of women. And she says, I know. I know what you are. Like, I know who you are. And she says, where is she? And another woman is like, who? And Riel is like, my daughter. And the other women are like, again, who. Like, as if she doesn't have one. Cut immediately to an image of her emerging from a cabinet that she had been hiding in. There was a massacre that took place at this school, and everyone in the room that she was just in, you know, being hugged and, you know, doted on and whatnot. They were victims of the massacre that day. And the only reason that she survived is because she hid in a cabinet and let everyone else die. Bull finds her and tells her that they need to leave right now. And so they hide and very carefully make their way to, you know, this meeting place in which is going to take them to freedom. Freedom of the chaos, right? And protection. [00:58:47] Speaker A: And they walk through the night. [00:58:50] Speaker B: They hide from, you know, their aggressors and finally make their way to this gathering point where there is like a bus. And, you know, they're loading people onto the bus, they're trying to get as many people as they can on, and there's just not enough room. So what ends up happening is Ball and, you know, real are so desperate that they're trying to find a way to get onto the bus. And there's no way to do it because they're only letting people on the bus with children. And there is just so happens to be a little girl in the crowd that's not theirs that they scoop up and say, oh, okay, yeah, we have a baby. She's right here. They kidnapped a younger. They kidnapped a child from someone else in order to make room on this bus for themselves. And this little girl is screaming out the window, looking at her real biological mother while her mom is being chased after by. By men with machine guns because they're going to die, right? And she is running behind the bus until she can't anymore. And she's shot, screaming for her daughter. This daughter was never Ball and Riels. They let someone, they, instead of dying, stole the life of someone else by kidnapping a child to make room for themselves on this fucking bus. Cut to them crossing the English Channel. And now we see what really happened on that boat. Ball chose to save from the water out of the three of them. He chose to save Riel. And he let Nyagak die. He let her drown. He left her. And this is hard. This is so hard for Riel to accept because she made a promise to this little girl that even though she was not her mother, she was going to take care of her. [01:01:29] Speaker A: And. [01:01:30] Speaker B: And this is. This is what happened. This is a result. BAAL chose to save Riel instead. So she's back in this classroom with all of these, you know, women who are advising her like, there's a way to get her back. All you have to do is kill Bhaal. That's it. And they give her a knife. So this was a vision, a dream, if you will, from the apeth. And Riel wakes up. She had perhaps fallen, but she wakes up outside of, you know, right outside the window against the house, and it's raining. And Bol finds her and brings her inside. So I'm sure you're thinking, well, there's only one logical thing that's left to do. And Bol feels the same way. And so there's conveniently a very, very large knife on the kitchen counter. Bol stands up, grabs it and Sits down at the table, and he cuts a ginormous slit in his arm. And he's like, look, I should have saved her. I should have tried harder to do that. And so this. This is what it wants. And as soon as I, you know, open my flesh, it's going to come. So you need to leave. I'm gonna give it what it wants, and you are going to get Nyaga back. So from the kitchen floor emerges the apeth. It is horrific. And he basically pins down, you know, BAAL to the floor and he starts to rip at the open wound on Baal's arm. And as this is happening, Nyaga comes back and walks right up to Rial and holds her hand. Rial, in a, you know, shocking turn of events actually, though, lets go of Nyagak's hand and walks into the dining room where, you know, this apethe is trying to take the life of Bhaal. And she picks up the knife and she slits the throat of the apeth entirely. And so she, in turn, saves Bhaal's life. The screen fades. The hole in the kitchen floor now where the apethe emerged from is covered with a rugged. All the holes in the living room have been repaired. And, you know, they come back for another inquiry or an inspection, right, with the caseworker. And the caseworker is like, yeah, I was just, you know, wondering, are there any other. Any other witches that you've encountered? Is the witch still here? And he kind of laughs at the two of them, and they're like, you know, hey, we were thinking of painting the living room red. He asks about the rats, and Ball admits that perhaps he was being a little dramatic about the rat infestation. And the caseworker is like, look, do you still see her? Ball is like, do I still see my daughter? Yeah, Your ghosts will follow you because they never leave you. And when you let them in, you can finally begin to face yourself. Raelle says to the caseworker, this is our home. We are happy here. And the caseworker leaves. As they stare from the living room across the hall into the dining room, they see Nyagak. And then suddenly, the whole house is filled with people. People who died, people who lost their lives, people who sacrificed so that Ball in real life, and hand in hand, they stand together and the film ends. So. So that was a lot. And now it's the time where we ask ourselves, what does this all mean? [01:06:37] Speaker A: So, first, I think it's important to talk a little bit about, like, the history of Sudan so you can Get a better idea of exactly what is happening there. It may or may not a country that you think often about, and you'll see the irony of this in just a moment. So in terms of Sudan, Sudan is the youngest nation, I believe so. Or South Sudan, I should say. South Sudan was officially named as. As a country and recognized globally as a country with like, its own name on the map in 2011. Right. So that is cool. Except not a lot of good things have been happening in South Sudan since they were officially recognized as a country. It is extraordinarily impoverished. It is a turbulent and violent place. And that's not to say that there are not good people there, but what it is to say is that these are characteristics of what we would consider a developing nation. And because they are such a relatively young and new nation, there's really. There hasn't been like, enough time for their country to sort of unite or put on a united front in such a way that, you know, the citizens band together in order to make the. The country better. Right. Often that's what happens. And. And, you know, becoming more modern obviously helps as well, countries to develop, but it's just a relatively young nation. And so for all intents and purposes, this is something that they're still struggling with to this day. And I'm hopeful that this will not continue for them forever. But I think as they become more established and have their own, you know, values as a country holistically, and that just having that name recognition as a country provides a lot of clarity around their identity. So in terms of the British, okay, Britain had very much wanted to solidify their interest, I should say. Again, you may or may not be aware, but in Africa, right? They're back in the day. Many, many, many moons ago. You know, the French and the Dutch were all up in Africa, right? They were like, okay, land, great, I'm gonna take it. And I'm going to enslave all the people that live here because I have guns. So that was mainly their prerogative. You may notice that a lot of people from African countries speak French or Dutch, right? And often English as well. So don't think that the Brits can got off scot free from this, because they absolutely did not, since they knew that their, you know, evil stepbrother quote unquote, France was down there doing the most, okay? They were like, well, we need some interest down there too. Thus commencing the Anglo Egyptian conquest of Sudan, which occurred from 1896 to 1899. And. And it was actually a reconquest of a territory that Egypt had lost during a previous war in 1884-1885. That war was called the Mahdist war. That war is a war that was fought to establish a strict Islamist state right in the region. So thus bringing in the Brits one more time. So the British had basically not done their part to withdraw the Egyptian army from Sudan timely. And so only certain pieces of Sudan were still left under the control of Egypt after 1885. So this reconquest from 1896 to 1899 basically took the Islamist state that had been established, destroyed it, and then they re established the Anglo Egyptian rule, which Sudan actually remained under until 1956. So the Brits already had influence over Egypt. And because of the recent, you know, development of an establishment of this Islamic state, the Brits saw this as a threat to their overall interest in the region. And because of the strategic placement of the Suez Canal, they wanted to make sure that they still had an interest in Egypt and the Suez Canal. Right. So that's why they ultimately intervened here. And again, this Anglo Egyptian Sudan was essentially until 1956, and it put the Anglo Egyptian Sudan under joint rule between Britain and Egypt, even though Britain had de facto control. It's kind of like how Denmark has de facto decision making power over Greenland. Right. So this is kind of what the vibes were. And again, since then things have been very, very turbulent. Now that's just a little bit of the backstory about Sudan, South Sudan. So as you can imagine, it's essentially a place where things have not been peaceful necessarily in really their, you know, entire history. And as sad as that is, it also makes it a dangerous place to be, potentially. Right. It depends on who you are. For women and children, I would argue, yes, that can be dangerous. So I find it really interesting with all of that in mind that Ball and Riel left Sudan, left South Sudan to go to Britain. It's almost like why the. Why the person. Why the people who used to rule you are the people that you're fleeing to. And again, I don't know the answer to that. It's not really explored in the film why they act, why they like, ended up in Britain. Like, there's really not any explanation as to why that happened, but I just found that ironic. And I thought you might like to know that ultimately here what this film is exploring is, in my opinion, survivor guilt. And survivor guilt is something that people of horrific tragedies often experience. Like, I, I don't know why, I don't know how you Couldn't. Right. Like, these are just things that once you experience life in such a. In such a way, you really sit and think about, like, how did I survive and I escape and other people didn't. And so all of these, you know. [01:14:50] Speaker B: Ghosts or entities that are living within. [01:14:54] Speaker A: The walls are representative of those that were left behind or those that died and along the way. Right. Could be at any point in history, but there was obviously a lot of war and instability within their country throughout history that these people could be representative of, you know, many, many different stages of the country's evolution to today. And then obviously, for real. And Ball, this is, you know, what is the most recent for them, which is the fact that they were able to escape and others were not. And in particular, Nyagak, the girl that they kidnapped. Right. That. That is really, really tough. When you examine the film itself in the sequence that it plays out in, the mother, Nyagak's real mother, her biological mother, was not at the bus when Rial and Ball were there. She was running to get to it, but she wasn't physically there already. So you can't make the argument that, you know, Nyagak and her biological mom should have been the ones to get on the bus because they were closing the doors and Nyagok's biological mom was not there. Right. So in order for this child to live, at first it seemed like an okay thing for her to end up on this bus to what, you know, is perceived safety. And while I can. I can empathize with that, the fact of the matter is you took a child that did not belong to you morally, you stole a human being away from its biological mother and left the biological mother to die. So that is why this is such a morally complex situation and something that I think I will think about for a very, very long time, because it seems like if the intent for Rialanbal to take Nyagak was to just save her life, then I think I'd be like, oh, okay, well, like, that makes sense. I mean, her mom wasn't there. Her mom didn't get there until after the doors to the bus were already closed. But that's not the intention with which they took her. They took her so that they could get on the bus, so that they could go to safety. They essentially just used a child, another human being, to save themselves, not for the purposes of saving her. And you can see that throughout the film, Rial refers to Nyagak as her daughter. Right. Nyagak is not her daughter. Okay. Nyagak is someone else's daughter that you stole so that you could get out of a bad situation. If you really cared that much about her surviving, you would have simply just thrown her onto that bus and walked away and been like, okay, this is my fate. I gotta, you know, I have to deal with this. But she's calling Nyagok her daughter throughout the film because it allows her to dissociate from the fact that this child was stolen from another human. So by her, you know, referring to the child as my daughter, she's separating the fact that they stole this child from another person altogether. And that it seems to be why this guilt is manifesting differently for Rial than it is for baal. Because BAAL is like, that kid wasn't even my kid. It was just a kid, but it wasn't my kid, right? So like, for him, he's only thinking about the fact that there are people that died and he feels bad about that. Rial feels bad because there was a child that she promised to protect that she had essentially accepted as her own in order to provide that protection and did not do it because she wasn't able to do it. Because in the scene where they fall overboard and they're in the ocean or they're in the sea, the ball is holding Riel swimming with her back to the boat. So, like, she couldn't even get to Nyagok even if she wanted to. So what is exactly survivor guilt? Survivor guilt happens when individuals feel guilty after surviving a tragic event, a near death event, a traumatic event in which other people did not survive. And it has, you know, now been, my understanding is it's now not its own syndrome in the dsm, previously referred to as like survivor disorder or survivor syndrome, it's now a just significant symptom of ptsd. So it's within the PTSD diagnosis and it's a symptom of that, which I think makes a lot of sense. And so I want to be clear that this is not like something that is solely isolated to war or wartime or, you know, ethnic cleansing events. This is something that can happen and be present through any number of things. One example would be like, I don't know, like a, you know, how they have like cancer support groups for cancer patients to go to. And, you know, it's kind of like a safe space to talk about your own feelings and what you've been going through. And like, you know, that other people in the room with you can understand and can empathize because they're also going through it. Well, if one of those groups loses one of the members or loses one of the patients, that can be a trigger for this type of survivor guilt. Because then you have to ask yourself, well, like, well, they were such a good person. Why did they go and not me, right? And of course, the manifestation of this guilt will depend on your. Your psychological profile overall. But roughly, it's noted, like, 5.6% of people that experience some type of traumatic event will be diagnosed with ptsd. And so symptoms will include, like, avoiding situations that could remind you of the event that you went through, or fear or being fearful when there's no threat. It could be reliving the event in your mind every single day unwillingly. Right? Like, it's not something you want to do, but you're gonna. You. You do it anyway. Like, your brain just does it. And then feelings of distress, right, that can just impact your everyday activities and your livelihood. Like sleeping, right? Like, sometimes sleeping can be a trigger for people. They can't sleep because as soon as they go to sleep, they have a nightmare and they have. They see the event again. And so they don't want to sleep. Or, you know, in the film, right, Ball is awake at night and he hears, you know, teenagers or just drunken idiots outside being loud. And, like, in the first night that they're in the house, like, that triggers the sound of his screaming, of screaming that he hears, like, in his ear from, you know, just. It's a loud environment. [01:23:39] Speaker B: He was in a loud environment when. [01:23:41] Speaker A: Something very tragic happened. And it's interesting because this type of guilt wasn't actually identified until the 1960s. And so, like, several therapists had kind of gotten together and been like, well, hey, we're all treating Holocaust survivors. What types of symptoms are your patients experiencing? And through this type of conversation, they had uncovered that almost all of their patients had nearly identical or even just similar. Right. Symptoms. Like, they were all just kind of experiencing the same things. [01:24:28] Speaker B: So. [01:24:31] Speaker A: One thing that I think is really interesting is that it's noted that a. A psychologist named Steven Joseph goes on to further identify this and break it down to say that he was studying the capsize of the Ms. Herald of free enterprise. And that was, you know, there were 459 people on board and 193 of them died. So throughout his studies, it was shown that 60% of those survivors were suffering from this survivor guilt. And he identified three different types of survivor guilt. And so the first one is those that were feeling guilty about staying alive when others died. Just plain and simple. They were they were feeling guilty that, you know, other people died, but they got to live. The second type is guilt about things that they failed to do. So this happens a lot when things like, you know, an intrusion will happen, or like, you know, that. That again, that unwillingness to, like, relive that memory or that event is happening. And so when they relive this event again and again and again, they. Their brain will be like, well, you should have done this, or you could have done this, or, why didn't you do this? Of course, you can't go back in time to fix any of that, but that's what their brain is doing. And the third type is feelings of guilt about what they did do, right? And so this group of people usually wants to avoid thinking all together about the actual catastrophe or the actual event. They don't want to be reminded of what happened or what actually really happened. So they might, you know, not. [01:26:41] Speaker B: They may. [01:26:41] Speaker A: They may just try to block that memory out. For example, climbing over other people to escape, right? Like, those people are going to die potentially because you climbed over them. But having to relive the idea that another human died as a result of maybe your action or their inaction is something that's really, really, really hard. And sometimes those that suffer from this blame themselves for the deaths of others, even blaming themselves for the deaths of people who died while rescuing the survivor or, you know, who the survivor unsuccessfully attempted to save. So again, we know about this as a result of the obviously extremely unfortunate event that was the Holocaust. But having this type of symptom be so well documented and described is really, really helpful, especially when those with, you know, this, that are suffering from this type of mental distress are able to verbalize it, then they're able to. They're able to get the help that they need, right? So what I think is really interesting is that, like, this is not necessarily unique to just this film, but the idea that both Rial and Ball are experiencing survivor guilt, but. But experiencing it in, like, not exactly the same ways is really, really interesting. It's almost like they are at odds with one another solely because of what they're both going through the same thing. They're just experiencing it in different ways. And so, like, they both feel guilty that they survived while other people died. But Rial feels that way throughout the film, whereas Ball only feels that way towards the end of the film. For him, you know, he. Immediately after they leave the detention center and they get a home, he's like, okay, I can do this. Like, I can do this. We're in this land now where I'm safe and my wife is safe. And we can, you know, do things that people in safe countries get to fucking do, like go to work every day and not have to worry if somebody's gonna come in and rob you, or, like, sleep in your home at night and not have to worry that somebody's gonna blow it up while you're sleeping. So for him, and Riel makes it a point to tell him, like, I can't believe that you idolize these people here when they're not better than us. She almost kind of says it in a way that's like, they don't know what it's like to be us. They don't know what it's like to live like we've lived. And while that very well may be true, we don't know the background about every single character in the film in that detail. But what we do know is the way that Riel feels through the whole film is guilt that other people died while she got to escape, right? And she got to live and she got to come to a place and she gets her own house. And she feels, like, undeserving of those things because there were other people that didn't get to come with her. And BAAL is like, you know what? He's that third type of survivor guilt, right? Like, he has feelings of guilt about what he did do. His guilt is from the fact that he saved real and didn't make any effort, really, to save Nyagok. And even if he did, who's to say he would have been able to, right? Because they were crossing the English Channel. It's not like. It's like a, you know, a super nice, easygoing body of water. [01:31:12] Speaker B: So. [01:31:14] Speaker A: He feels guilty in that way. He doesn't really feel guilty that other people died. He only feels guilty that he did something. So, like, all of his visions or dreams that he has are of. Of them being in the water, right? Because that's where his action led to an ultimate heartbreaking loss. Rial feels guilt as a whole about the situation because she is not just speaking with Nyagak when she's speaking with, you know, the people in the home or the apath. She's. When she opens the door, right to the closet to get cleaning supplies out, she sees a whole truck full of people. And none of those people are Nyagak or baal, they're just people. So I really think that this film was an interesting way to portray survivor guilt in a way that I've maybe never seen it before. Normally it's much more obvious. This is not so obvious. You know, Ball is also refers to them living in London or in England as a fresh start, right? And they're, like, reborn. And the look on Riel's face when he says this is just kind of like. Of disbelief. Like, how can he even be talking about something like this when other people are dead? So it's not new for me to see a film about trauma where trauma manifests as something physical. That part is not new to me. Although I will tell you that the way that the apeth looked was new to me. I can really only describe them looking similar to the dude from Pan's Labyrinth, which terrifies me, who has the eyeballs in his hands. But, well. And this thing, the apeth, was huge. Like, really, really big. But, you know, there's also the fact of the matter that survivors sometimes feel guilty that they survived the trauma and other people may not have, right? So, like, it's. You go through the event now, you have this trauma, you carry it. And for some people, that load is way too fucking heavy to carry, and they don't see another way out, and they don't have the strength to do it anymore, and they have to just be done. And I empathize with those people because I can certainly see how. How that happens at the end. I think it's really profound that the house is full of, you know, the ghosts of these people who were not, you know, were not survivors. They weren't able to make it out alive. And it's a reminder that you can't let things like this rule your entire life. Right? Like, they were at a point in the film where Ball was going to give up his own life just because of the guilt that they felt. And the manifestation of this, a peth was kind of like, well, this is your fault, right? It's like somebody died because of you, so now you got to go, too. And he really had, like, convinced himself that that was really the only way out, and he was gonna. So the whole film, the. These entities and this, you know, memory had controlled them both. But they realized at the end that you have to kind of kill the guilt. You don't have to kill the memory necessarily, because that's not something that, like, goes away, but the guilt surrounding it is something that you have to be free of because you'll never, ever progress. So I saw the end as being profound in the way that they will continue to progress as a couple and as people and in life. So yeah, that is his house. I hope you enjoyed this episode as much as I enjoyed making it. Before I let you go, I have to let you know that the final girl on 6th Avenue is part of the Morbidly Beautiful Network. Morbidly Beautiful is your home for horror in any way, shape or form. If you like it then you are welcome with us. You can check out my podcast and many others like it. If you head on over to morbidly beautiful.com youm can find this podcast on Google Podcasts, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music. If you enjoyed the show, it would mean the world to me if you left me a five star review and subscribe to the show wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you so much for listening. Again, I hope you enjoyed this episode and perhaps will embark on the journey of actually watching this film. I think it's great. It's on Netflix, so please take some time. It's only an hour and a half, you know, so it's a heavy film. There's a couple jump scares, so be prepared for that. But I really recommend this to almost anyone. There's really not an audience that I can think of that would not like a film like this, so take some time to check it out. I'll be back to talk to y' all very, very soon. And until then, never Forget that I'm 6th Avenue's very own final Girl. [01:37:37] Speaker B: It.